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Israel and Lebanon - what the hell is going on?  This thread currently has 11218 views. Print
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x452
July 26, 2006, 4:05pm Report to Moderator
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Quoted from aquamonkey

In conclusion, if the camel f****rs in lebenon, palestine, iraq, etc would say wear a militaty uniform, or operate from a military installation rather than blending if with civilians, you put an end to (or atleast severaly decrease) civilian deaths


Nice language  

In case you're not aware this is war is far from "conventional". The terrorists, because they don't have the latest weaponry and defence capabilities the U.S. or Israel has hide among civilians for a number of reasons including:

1) the ability to "blend in" and thus avoid detection by the enemy
2) make the enemy think twice about attacking areas that has innocent civilians
3) when the U.S. or Israel kill innnocent civilians it helps the extremist's cause by proving how evil the U.S. and Israel are and helps them to recruit more people to their cause

Both sides are using extreme strategies to try and win, both sides don't seem to have a problem killing civilians.
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Vecordious
July 26, 2006, 4:34pm Report to Moderator

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China Condemns Israeli Air Strike

http://www.smh.com.au/news/world/china-condemns-israeli-air-strike/2006/07/26/1153816236162.html

"China strongly condemned today an Israeli air strike in Lebanon that killed a Chinese United Nations observer and summoned Israel's ambassador in Beijing to demand an apology."


That's what you want to do - piss China off  


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Aussies_Online
July 26, 2006, 10:28pm Report to Moderator
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Quoted from x452

So you believe Israel dropping a bomb on a building or entire town containing innocent civilians in an attempt to kill one or a handful or terrorists is justified? Or the U.S. invading an entire country and killing 10's of thousands of innocent people to kill or capture a handful of terrorists is justified?


It's called "WAR".
But you are probably too young to know what that is.
When you are at war with a country, each one of its citizen becomes the ennemy. Why do you think that over 1000 Americans soldiers have been killed in Iraq?

Because silly people like you force them to fight a politically correct war where you have lunch with the father whose son is in the army and is waiting outside to ambush you when you walk out of his house.

Terrorists targets civilians only.
But you don't seem to have too much of a problem with that.

Quoted Text
January 30 - Hamas rejects a call from the Middle East Quartet to renounce violence and recognise Israel.


Anyone really surprised about this?
Hamas has sung that song since 1947.

At the rate this is going, we are going to have a repeat of 1967 where Israel will take everything back again and throw everyone out. And I won't blame them. What sort of a life is this when you have to continually watch your back for a terrorist attack every day of every year. Quite frankly, if I was running Israel, Hamas would have been dead a long time ago. If that mean flattening every building in Palestine, so be it. I don't give a s**t about its citizen. Half of them are protecting Hamas while pretending to be ordinary civilians.



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Vecordious
July 27, 2006, 8:06am Report to Moderator

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Israel using chemical weapons

http://www.smh.com.au/news/World/Israel-using-chemical-weapons-doctors/2006/07/27/1153816285823.html


Quoted Text
Lebanese President Emile Lahoud has repeatedly accused Israel of using phosphorus bombs in its offensive.

Human Rights Watch, which has accused the Israeli army of using cluster bombs in populated areas of southern Lebanon, said it had not verified claims that Israel had used phosphorus.

"We are investigating but we haven't confirmed anything yet. We have seen phosphorus used before and we have seen it in the artillery stocks of the Israeli army in the north," said Peter Bouckaert, emergencies director at Human Rights Watch.




hmmm.... playing dirty now?  



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x452
July 27, 2006, 3:02pm Report to Moderator
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Quoted from Aussies_Online

It's called "WAR".


I'd call it an "illegal invasion" rather than a war.

The U.S. made up lies about Saddam Hussein's involvement with 9/11 and Bin-Laden and illegally invaded Iraq. Iraq did not declare war on the U.S. nor did it provoke the U.S.

Israel have illegally invaded Lebanon to root out terrorists. Lebanon did not attack nor did they provoke Israel, so why go to war against the entire country?

If the U.N. were functioning properly they should have the power to arrest and charge the U.S. and Israeli Governments for war crimes.

The war isn't as simple as "we're the good guys and they're the bad guys". But you're probably too old to realise that.

Until the west begings to act morally and lawfully terrorism will never go away no matter how many bombs are dropped.

As far as we've come how is it possible that a country can invade another country at will all because it has more weapons.
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Gizmo
July 27, 2006, 3:50pm Report to Moderator
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Quoted from x452

The war isn't as simple as "we're the good guys and they're the bad guys". But you're probably too old to realise that.
.


That line is pretty offensive!    . . you think anyone over 21 is too old to understand what is going on in the Middle East??!!  you should be embarrassed to be seen talking like that to any member here .  . and the value of your argument just went  the drain.   


DEMOCRACY = Voters deciding by Poll on who will be the local member that "Big Business" will push around.  
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boomslanger
July 27, 2006, 4:47pm Report to Moderator

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Quoted from Gizmo


That line is pretty offensive!    . . you think anyone over 21 is too old to understand what is going on in the Middle East??!!  you should be embarrassed to be seen talking like that to any member here .  . and the value of your argument just went  the drain.   

Hang on Gizmo, be a little fair and balanced. He was derided for being "too young to understand" and that is the context in which he replied.


Everyone is entitled to be stupid, but some abuse the privilege.
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SuziH
July 27, 2006, 5:09pm Report to Moderator

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First of all I want to post a report in today's news then I need to say some things to a couple of forum members in particular and everyone in general.  

Australian fighter killed
David Braithwaite, Jano Gibson and Dylan Welch
July 27, 2006 - 3:20PM

An Australian fighting for Israeli forces in Lebanon has been killed in action.
Assaf Namer, 26, was one of eight soldiers who died during a battle on Wednesday.
Mr Namer had only one month left to serve in the Israeli army, the Israeli newspaper Yediot Achronot reported.
"Sergeant Assaf Namer, an Israeli youngster with an Australian citizenship, had left Israel with his mother and sister when he was 10 years old and returned to Israel two-and-a-half years ago to enlist in the army," the newspaper said.
"Assaf was due to be discharged a month from now, and was planning to settle down in Israel with his girlfriend, Revital, who lives in Tel Aviv."
"He used to spend his vacations with Revital and at the house of his grandmother, who lives in Kiryat Yam, near Haifa.
"[On] Wednesday night army representatives arrived at the grandmother's house to deliver the terrible news." Assaf's grandmother had informed his father, Tzachi, of his son's death.
Yoel Meinrath, a school friend of Mr Namer, said he was devastated by the news.
"I'm sitting with a friend at the moment and we are both sitting here in shock. It's really shocking when you hear about the news overseas. [But] they are just numbers. When you actually hear a name, it really hits home," Mr Meinrath said, adding that he had seen Mr Namer outside a Bondi Junction cinema only a few weeks ago.
NSW Jewish Board of Deputies chief executive Vic Alhadeff said the man's sister and mother were on their way to Israel.
"We were extremely upset to hear about the death as we are all casualties of this war," Mr Alhadeff said.
Assaf came to Australia 15 years ago as a child with his family and made aliyah about two years ago, the Australian Jewish News reported.
He attended Jewish high school Moriah College in Queens Park and sat for the HSC in 1997.
A Rabbi from the Great Synagogue in Elizabeth Street said an email from Moriah College had been circulated today, telling the community that Namer had died fighting with the Israeli Defence Force.
"The boy who was killed is a former student of Moriah College who had gone back to live with his father in Israel," Rabbi Jeremy Lawrence said.
"He is remembered as a quiet student, a good basketball player - he played on the team - and a graphic artist."
The statement, from Moriah College principal Roy Steinman, said: "He was a talented graphics artist and produced wonderful cartoons and images when computer graphics was in its infancy.
"Some years ago, Assaf took the decision to settle in Israel.
"Our heartfelt condolences go to his parents and family. We mourn with them."
Moriah College is expected to hold a memorial tomorrow.
The Department of Foreign Affairs and Trade confirmed Mr Namer's death.
"A 26-year-old Australian-Israeli dual national from Sydney serving with the Israeli Defence Force was killed in fighting in southern Lebanon on 26 July," the department said in a statement this afternoon.
Consular officers were providing assistance to family members, who had asked for privacy, the statement said.
A date for Assaf's funeral will be set once his mother and sister arrive in the country.

http://www.smh.com.au/news/wor.....ullpage#contentSwap1

That was a damned rude statement/comment you made x452 to which Gizmo responded to and now I am.  "But you're probably too old to realise that." is a throw away comment (on your part) that makes no sense but is very discourteous at the same time. All I can say is that one day x452, you will be 'TOO OLD' also and I hope someone treats you with the same lack of respect.
Aquamonkey... please tone down the language. The statement where you called people from the middle East a very derogatory term is just not on. Disguising an obvious obscenity by replacing one letter with * is not acceptable. I am editing that word in your post and any other references to it.
To all... please this is a very sensitive issue and must be discussed with decorum and calm. It is not a slanging match or a contest of one-up-manship. The protagonists in this conflict are doing enough of that for every one.


A Happy New Year
to You All!!
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x452
July 27, 2006, 5:44pm Report to Moderator
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Quoted from Gizmo


That line is pretty offensive!    . . you think anyone over 21 is too old to understand what is going on in the Middle East??!!  you should be embarrassed to be seen talking like that to any member here .  . and the value of your argument just went  the drain.   


Please read the post I was responding to fully before taking my post out of context.

This is the comment I was responding back to.

Quoted from Aussies_Online

It's called "WAR".
But you are probably too young to know what that is.


Same goes for your SuziH, if you read my post in context I was responding to Aussies_Online, it was not aimed at anyone else on the forum.
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Vecordious
July 27, 2006, 6:16pm Report to Moderator

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Iranians volunteer to fight Israel


http://www.cnn.com/2006/WORLD/meast/07/26/iran.volunteers.ap/index.html


Taken from the article

Quoted Text
TEHRAN, Iran (AP) -- Surrounded by yellow Hezbollah flags, more than 60 Iranian volunteers set off Wednesday to join what they called a holy war against Israeli forces in Lebanon.

The group -- ranging from teenagers to grandfathers -- plans to join about 200 other volunteers on the way to the Turkish border, which they hope to cross Thursday. They plan to reach Lebanon via Syria on the weekend.



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Aussies_Online
July 27, 2006, 8:30pm Report to Moderator
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Quoted from x452


I'd call it an "illegal invasion" rather than a war.

The U.S. made up lies about Saddam Hussein's involvement with 9/11 and Bin-Laden and illegally invaded Iraq. Iraq did not declare war on the U.S. nor did it provoke the U.S.

Israel have illegally invaded Lebanon to root out terrorists. Lebanon did not attack nor did they provoke Israel, so why go to war against the entire country?

The war isn't as simple as "we're the good guys and they're the bad guys".


Yes it is that simple. Always is. You are either with us or against us.

Like it or not... But we are at war.

The Western World and most of the rest of the world declared war on terrorism after the 9/11.

Any country which choose knowingly to harbour terrorists is against us and in doing so becomes our ennemy. That is why we have the right to declare war against those countries and invade them.

We are not going to play that childish game where we will have a terrorist killing half a dozen of us and then run home to hide behind the skirt of his grandma so that we won't kill him because we don't want to hurt his grandma. The fact that the grandma hide him from us, makes her as guilty as he is.

And talking about the poor civilians...
During WWII, when the French Resistance killed one German, the Germans took 10 French civilians at random, put them against a wall and shoot them.

War is hell... And don't you forget it.

If you want to be nice to those terrorists, my advice to you is to leave Australia before Asio comes and knock on your door.


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Aussies_Online
July 27, 2006, 8:36pm Report to Moderator
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Quoted from SuziH
An Australian fighting for Israeli forces in Lebanon has been killed in action.
Assaf Namer, 26, was one of eight soldiers who died during a battle on Wednesday.
Mr Namer had only one month left to serve in the Israeli army, the Israeli newspaper Yediot Achronot reported.
"Sergeant Assaf Namer, an Israeli youngster with an Australian citizenship, had left Israel with his mother and sister when he was 10 years old and returned to Israel two-and-a-half years ago to enlist in the army," the newspaper said.


You do realise of course that it is illegal under Australian Law for any immigrant to return to his country of origin in order to enlist in the army and even more so to fight in a war.

The minute he enlisted in the Israeli army, he lost his Australian citizenship. Which explain why he was not coming back.



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SuziH
July 27, 2006, 9:38pm Report to Moderator

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I didn't know that A-O. I never considered that if someone went back to their country of birth to 'fight for that country' they would forfeit citizenship in any other country. It makes sense though.

I am sorry I didn't read the comment earlier regarding 'being too young to understand' which was out of line too. Let's not get personal folks and remember we were young once and we weren't that stupid either. It's just as we get older we have more life experience and apparently gain wisdom. Our brains are crammed with more knowledge and information. My daughter is 29 now and equally as wise, knowledgeable and worldly wise as I am at 50.


A Happy New Year
to You All!!
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Vecordious
July 28, 2006, 6:59am Report to Moderator

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Quoted from Aussies_Online


You do realise of course that it is illegal under Australian Law for any immigrant to return to his country of origin in order to enlist in the army and even more so to fight in a war.

The minute he enlisted in the Israeli army, he lost his Australian citizenship. Which explain why he was not coming back.






It brings us back to: "You're either AUSTRALIAN or you're not". If you want to live here and claim citizenship then why go fight for another country? If you want to fight for that country, go live there.  Why did people come here to live? Because we are a free country and have no wars, but what do they do? They bring their wars here  


In heaven, there are no interesting people - Nietzsche
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GlenTheAdmin
July 28, 2006, 8:21am Report to Moderator
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A reminder to all users that all comments that are deemed racist or otherwise offensive will be deleted from eBlah! and a warning issued.

This thread has remained constructive as a whole, but we have deleted part of a post due to offensive language.

Continue on..


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