Quoted from Lawnbowler
I class myself a Christian, yet do not class myself religious. Does that make sense, it does to me. I have christian principles which I believe in and try to live by, although sometimes I think I fail badly at living up to my own standards of what is right and wrong.
I do not go to church, but I do not feel less of a christian because of it.
there really is no answer in the poll that suits me...............
I answered "A little bit" for similar reasons, but also because 'religious' kind of implies affiliation and acceptance of the larger body that is associated with the beleif and Church isn't a bad thing, especially most Christian churches, however it does seem to me that it's built up
more, in the end or how it serves to function, on just a social environment than it does on spiritual fellowship and this quite frankly can easily ruin the whole thing quickly for me. It creates gossip and pride and gossip always annoys the living piss out of me.. it's a charactor flaw of my own. I get very aggravated when I learn that I've been gossiped about and supprise, supprise that 90% of the time it's simply not true. If people said true things about me I couldn't complain for very long before having to admit it to myself... this is NOT what happens in any church "fellowship" that I've been close enough to, to make a fair observation. I've never been bit that hard by church gossip because I've had the good sense to get away from it before it could.
With gossip of course comes pride, saving face, and all the fun energy involved with that. It's never been a problem for me except that I have felt very tense when figuring out how much myself I could be around people I know who are heavily involved with their churches. Usually there's nothing at all to worry about but don't go act like that near the church building itself or when there's more than 4 members present who also don't know their comfort level with each other... it's pretty silly when it's examined.
Pride also with some people... how well they know their bibles, that they can quote scripture that applies to common sense like um... someone says "Look both ways before you cross the street" and there's always the one guy who can say "That's just like when God said to Noah...."
Very annoying are preachers who's position has put them in a self delusionally proud space, narrowmined to externel suggestion. I completely understand how this happens all the way to the degree that when I've met people who've held those positions for a long time and don't seem to be up themselves, I find myself impressed and wonder how they maintain a healthy attitude with this.
Despite understanding how it happens. It's still very annoying.
I was brought up as an Athiest and later recognised Jesus so as a result I never learned fear of the guy up on the stage or felt that he was in any way differant then me. In fact I started out as a non-beileiver thinking that that guy was a gigantic moron so I wasn't influenced to respect him any more than any other stranger. I of course figured out that he isn't a moron (usually) and that opening up to what he has to say can be good so long as it isn't taken as the word of God. On the stage and off the stage are 2 entirely differant things though.
Continuing from a couple of paragraphs above (I've gotten lost) about preachers being easily sucked into and blinded by pride, I have gone to church, and while talking to the guy who gave the sermon about the sermon, and pointing out that it was very good and could only be improved by being less harsh toward sinners and non-beleivers themselves by not calling them "The Devil" would be a good idea because not everyone in the churce is a beleiver and it isolotes them and makes them defensive and not open... I felt this was the easiest, most effective, and most non-confrontational way to put it. His response was that I don't know Jesus and am going to hell if that doesn't change.
Here's a conversation with another pastor about not much other than applying the bible to something I just said about my wife. This was in pre-marital counsiling which for people who don't know what that is, is something that a lot pastors do in attempt to filter out the people who are going to get divorced next week, because they can then go home and sleep better that they know they haven't blatently used their state given authority on something that was a horrible idea. It seems okay to me that someone would want to sleep better at night.
Me: -"...what can get to me though is that sometimes if she's afraid of what I might say on the phone to someone she'll snatch the phone right out of my hand. That really makes me mad but she doesn't do that anymore."
-Pastor "Dean... is it ever okay to become angry?"
- "...it is going to happen"
- "Dean... is it ever okay to become angry?"
- "it does happen"
- "Dean... is it ever okay to become angry?"
The above continues and was left unresolved. We left it at him being perfect and free of sin... that's how far it went.
Also this guy reckoned we were living in sing by not going to church every Sunday which he had a big problem with. This was the first pastor that we interviewed, as he interviewed us, and after this we couldn't be bothered but to go to a celebrant who wasn't religiously affiliated.
A lot of Catholics just plain accept the idea that many aspects of their religiousness is fundamentally flawed. It's good to see that they admit it. It's can still be fun to pick on Catholosism at the same time though.
Okay so despite these rather significant things, church
does have good things about it. It
is a place to renew faith and be reminded and conceed who is in charge, on a regular basis (or twice yearly in my case). I don't hate church, there are some things about it that keep me away and they also frankly make good excuses because I don't always want to go out of my way to go there. I'm going today. Today is one of my twice yearly visits. I'm not going to hear a sermon, sing,... well I am, but the reason I'll be there is to see someone that will also be there and that I might not get another chance to see after today. The very worst that can generally come of this is that I'll be bored for a while. Probably I'll find it was at some level usefull though.
That was a long a** post for saying "Church, in excess, is not something I find beneficial for myself but a bit the opposite." I was meaning to make another statement that was making this much more relevant to the previous discussion but I forgot what that is now.
